Why is someone wrong because they disagree with you? Discussion about 1st excerpt from Morris Kight Bio

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Billy Glover:

Ii will never understand how an intelligent person can completely misunderstand Don Slater. He was never wrong, as history is proving. I have letters from Morris, and others that show how much they got along. Morris did not also participate in the Motorcade, and neither of course did Dorr and Kepner, but Troy and Morris did join in the picketing of the Los Angeles Times. Would you say they were wrong and in a cocoon?

Don's reasoning was perfect, he said it was a private business. Also Morris and Don, and I have a newspaper article about it, tried to stop the city from renaming a block of a street after L Ron Hubbard/Scientology. Others didn't-does that mean they were in a cocoon?

There are glbt people in the right to life group and others who are for the right to choose. Neither side is wrong and in an ivory tower. Why do you continue to think Don slater, like Dorr one of the best thinkers on this cause in the world, is not up to your level? Some of us are in gay rodeos, others are in PET and opposing gay rodeos.

Morris opposed the war and thus (I think of course) misunderstood the issue of homosexuals in the military, and time has proved us right and him wrong. But that did not lessen his contribution to the cause.

I will later try to send an email quoting several letters from Don Slater, Morris Kight, Joe Hansen, etc that show that all of us, who loved and worked together, always had disagreements. I said things about Joe and Jane, as is reported in Todd's book, but it was only because iIwanted him to mention HIC in his books, nothing more. And he understood this and I have several letters in which he says good things about me and Don but then attacks, if I remember Dale Jennings, and I probably can find something where Dale disagreed with Joe, etc. that doesnt'mean any of us are wrong or in a cocoon. And Jim Schneider disagreed with all of us at some point. Yet he alone saved our HIC material.

I think it is great to have New York join the gay marriage bandwagon-of course they think that they are leading the parade, as usual, but i am well aware that there are those, and it is in ONE Magazine-iIhave all copies of the first year-that discuss the issues of marriage that are relevant today-and there are those who did NOT work for gay marriage because they want no special rights for any married people. That is their right and that doesn't make anyone wrong.:

Wayne Dynes:

In speaking of the Kight-Slater connection, let us not forget the Barney's Beanery affair, where Morris was on the right side, Don, perversely, on the wrong side.

Here are the basic facts. One of the first actions by the Los Angeles GLF was against a local eatery called "Barney's Beanery". The restaurant, located in West Hollywood, not only had a sign above the bar that said “Fagots [sic] Stay Out”, but also printed up matchbook covers with the same saying. The eatery also displayed an ax behind a glass case, labeled "fairy swatter."

Kight, along with Troy Perry and 100 activists protested outside, sending in protesters occasionally to order coffee and take up space at the tables. The protest was initially successful - the owner eventually handed Kight the sign in front of news cameras. But after the media left the owner duplicitously replaced the sign, where it remained until West Hollywood's first lesbian mayor, Valerie Terrigno, took it down when the city council passed an anti-discrimination ordinance.

Perry vowed at the initial protest to never set foot in the place again until the owner apologized, which finally happened in 2005. The new owner, David Houston, has apologized and, among other methods to reach out to the gay community, holds monthly lunches for disadvantaged gay youth.

Naturally, Don Slater never apologized. Dwelling in his little cocoon of self-certitude, he was never wrong.

Wayne

billy glover wrote:

Thanks for this great link. I tried to add a comment but it didn't work. Morris worked very much with politics and he also worked with Don Slater and the Homosexual Information Center. He gave us our first fund-raiser after Don's faction separated from Dorr Legg's faction of ONE.

GLF first met at HIC's Tangents office on Cahuenga near KPFK. Morris picked with us as did Troy Perry and others when the Los Angeles Times refused ads for a play, Geese, that we were working with.

He also worked with Don on his last "project" which was trying to keep the city from renaming part of a street after the founder of Scientology. Some would say that Morris' behavior, as in using the media for his purposes in Alpine county was sort of like we think the other guy used stupid people and the media to form a religion as a joke.

billy glover wrote:

show details Jun 25 (6 days ago)

He and Dorr both were good thinkers and saw all the possible unintended consequences of how to get our civil rights without appearing to seek special rights. He always opposed anything that looked like we would settle for a ghetto life-sort of what the pro-marriage people say about settling for civil unions. It is possible to work for our cause without thinking about the issues of homosexuality-but sooner or later those issues will have to be faced. They had good resources, such as Dr Hooker, great attorneys, etc. I still think Dorr's educational efforts, his book covers them, are better than most "queer" studies, and Don's magazine had a better balance than any publication today-of course it went broke because it didn't sell celebrities or ads, etc.

Remember that Don and several others in CA filed one of the first lawsuits to get rid of the sodomy laws. He said that no one had a right to ask about our sexuality-which may be how the DADT thing finally gets done. And he said that unless we get marriage rights, NO ONE should have them-something that is still a weapon to use against the bigots, since it means they have special rights. There is not an issue in our cause that was not covered in ONE/Tangents Magazine. Jim Kepner spotted "news' where no one else did in the late 1950s and early 1960s.

The one place not many people still understand the argument, but he was/is right about is the issue of cause. He didn't say what it was or care, BUT he always said it was bad pr to keep saying you should like/,love us because we were born this way and couldn't help it. He said, as some lesbians said at the time, we have our rights no matter why we are homosexual. He did not want to support or use hate crimes or affirmative action as he saw that it would be called seeking special rights and would slow us down. also we were told by law enforcement that it was not important since too often a jury would find someone innocent if there were a long sentence where they would find them guilty if they only had to serve a short time-so was it better to let the bully go free or get what you could.

billy glover:

show details Jun 25 (5 days ago)

Thanks for this great picture. And I always had the same feelings you did about these three. I was not that close to any of them, but as i've said, Harry and John visited me here in LA on a trip across the country, and Don and I visited them while they were in San Juan Pueblo. Harry and John were in the Motorcade, which Morris was not, nor was Jim, for the reason of not liking the war I think.

Morris, as I think I've shown, worked on several projects with Don, such as picketing the Los Angeles Times, and he gave us our first fund-raiser. He picketed Barney's Beanery, Don didn't for I think the reason that Don said it was a private place and should be ignored and thus punished, but things don't always work that way. And I think Morris, Troy, et al, saw it as a great pr thing, as of course Morris did about Alpine county takeover. I do think it interesting that Don's last project was with Morris trying to stop the naming of the street after Hubbard/Scientology.

The thing I regret is not having had enough sense to actually ask any of them about their history. I had to read Jim's history elsewhere. As in a sense I did Harry's. It never occurred to me to take pictures of our visit to New Mexico, or our picketing the Times, etc.

Karen wrote:

Gentlemen -

I have not yet read the book about which you're speaking. But when I first started reporting in the LGBT press, I got to know Jim Kepner, Harry Hay and Morris Kight and each were kind enough to teach me about LGBT history from their own perspectives. Jim and I spoke reporter-to-reporter, Morris often called me at 7:00am about some urgent news story, even though I wrote for weekly and bi-weekly publications, and Harry and John Burnside were my neighbors here in West Hollywood. Sometimes they gossiped about each other; but it seemed they also respected each other, in their own fashion. This is a photo I took at an event where Harry was honored.

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